Robert Sanchez

[martin1905]

Not sure where to put this as for some reason he doesn't seem to have his own thread but Robert Sanchez deserves a bit of a discussion.

He gets a fair bit of criticism some of it undoubtedly justified but he's beginning to look like a proper keeper. There aren't too many mistakes he's made,that I can remember,  that aren't down to his distribution. He makes top quality saves, real top quality and as I say I don't think he's conceded too many that he should have stopped.

If you take away some of his incredibly poor, at times,  work with his feet and it does seem to be getting less frequent do we potentially have a decent keeper on our hands. Some of the saves he had made I think are the type only a handful are capable of.

I'd love to see a compilation of all his saves and compare that to all the goals he has conceded that people feel he was at fault for, again not including some of his brain fart moments when he's trying to play. He's only just turned 27.  Does he have the potential to improve and become an elite GK or have I got it all wrong?

Very interested to hear other's views.

 

[My Blood Is Blue]

He was very good yesterday and he has been very good the last few games, but he has also made a lot of mistakes this season and for me, is still a weak link in the side. I'm not sure he'll ever be good enough to be one of the best in this league and therefore, I don't think he should be our long term number 1. He seems to be at his best when he doesn't have time to think/use his instincts.

Obviously, if his recent form becomes permanent and he genuinely does/has cut out the brain farts and he continues to show improvement, then I'm happy to change my view on him.

[xceleryx]

He's a tough ones Sanchez. On one hand he does, as mentioned already, make some seriously top tier saves. On the other though, his decision making and execution when playing out from the back has put us in hot water on several occasions. 

I don't see him being our long-term number one unless his brain fades are entirely ironed out to where they only happen a couple times a season. That said, credit where it's dude as he's also saved our bacon on several occasions and deservingly been applauded.

[Michael Tucker]

IMO. the last 'proper' keeper we had was Cech.  After him, nobody has been that good.

[chara]

Credit where credit is due...made a difference in recent games but I feel he is really playing at the top of his game in many ways, as was Mendy at one time.

I am not convinced that he will "level" out and play at this high standard without the brain farts etc.

If he does, then the position becomes less problematic, and I will hold up hands and admit I was wrong but the Mendy experience is fresh in my mind..the Top keepers have little or no doubts expressed about them from day one...just comments if they make an error.

[Mark Kelly]

Quiet reliability is a much better thing all round than being an epic shot stopper in my humble opinion , the ability to calm a jittery defence with your mere presence is underrated . 

Sanchez has ability , but he's also an idiot. 

[Ham]

19 hours ago, martin1905 said:

Not sure where to put this as for some reason he doesn't seem to have his own thread but Robert Sanchez deserves a bit of a discussion.

He gets a fair bit of criticism some of it undoubtedly justified but he's beginning to look like a proper keeper. There aren't too many mistakes he's made,that I can remember,  that aren't down to his distribution. He makes top quality saves, real top quality and as I say I don't think he's conceded too many that he should have stopped.

If you take away some of his incredibly poor, at times,  work with his feet and it does seem to be getting less frequent do we potentially have a decent keeper on our hands. Some of the saves he had made I think are the type only a handful are capable of.

I'd love to see a compilation of all his saves and compare that to all the goals he has conceded that people feel he was at fault for, again not including some of his brain fart moments when he's trying to play. He's only just turned 27.  Does he have the potential to improve and become an elite GK or have I got it all wrong?

Very interested to hear other's views.

 

I posted the same a few weeks ago. 

6 hours ago, Michael Tucker said:

IMO. the last 'proper' keeper we had was Cech.  After him, nobody has been that good.

Thibaut was excellent. No doubting that. Just a bit of a dick. 

[martin1905]

Appreciate everyone's views.

I'm just struggling a bit with all this talk about his mistakes and I'm not just talking about people on here. It seems everyone thinks the same but like I said in my original post I can't think of many mistakes he's made, apart from the obvious ones when it cones to his distribution, that have lead to us conceding. Even then how many times have the opposition scored direct from one of his mistakes placed passes?

I also can't think of many, if any, goals we have conceded that I'd blame entirely on him. Goals where you think he should have 100% stopped that.

So putting his distribution to one side, as to be fair to him it's probably the easiest thing to put right and it's been much better recently is he as bad as people male out?

His command of his area is very good, seems pretty decent at claiming crosses and his shot stopping, I think is elite. He makes saves others don't and because of that and the fact that even with his poor distribution I think he's saved us far more points this season than he's cost us. Far more. And isn't that the whole point of a GK? Someone that single handedly puts extra points on the board?

[Sciatika]

It's worth pointing out that Cech had his off days. I remember a particularly brainless pass to Romeu against Man Utd when two attackers were pressing the midfielder without an out ball and lost the ball, which led to a goal.

 

Edited December 24, 2024 by Sciatika

[CarefreeMuratcan]

In the last 2 games he has rescued us 3-4 points. The save against Brentford at 1-0, might have led to us drawing or losing if we had conceded. The saves against Everton at 0-0 might have led us to losing the game.

Edited December 24, 2024 by CarefreeMuratcan

[martin1905]

Also, I don't want to harp on about the previous manager.  Pretty sure everyone knows my views but I said time and again last season wasn't the time to judge. We weren't the most tactical, disciplined side in the world and were shambolic defensively. 

I think we have seen a vast improvement in him in the 16 league games he's played this year and at 27, which is not exactly old for a GK, does he not have the potential to continue improving under proper coaching and manager,  in a more disciplined side. Would appreciate  @chara views on this.

I'm not one for detailed stats and percentiles especially when it comes to GK's but would be interested how he fares against his peers this year. Maybe @xceleryx could help with that one.

[Michael Tucker]

8 minutes ago, Sciatika said:

It's worth pointing out that Cech had his off days.

Not many of them though.  

[Chelsea_Matt]

31 minutes ago, CarefreeMuratcan said:

In the last 2 games he has rescued us 3-4 points. The save against Brentford at 1-0, might have led to us drawing or losing if we had conceded. The saves against Everton at 0-0 might have led us to losing the game.

Maybe with the defence improving it's given Sanchez more confidence and vice-versa. Personally I do feel our goalies (and one or two defenders) are not top-class. Good, maybe top-4 level but not top class - I think Maresca is coaching them well, of course. If they stay consistent then top 4 is their limit imo, which would be fantastic this season. 🎄♥️💯

[Lump Of Celery]

2 hours ago, martin1905 said:

I'm just struggling a bit with all this talk about his mistakes and I'm not just talking about people on here. It seems everyone thinks the same but like I said in my original post I can't think of many mistakes he's made, apart from the obvious ones when it cones to his distribution, that have lead to us conceding.

I am terrible at remembering moments across the season, or what game they came in, which of ournplayers scored jn each game etc. There were articles going around about a month ago saying he had the most errors leading to goals of any keeper in Europe. About a week later articles saying he had the highest save % of any goalkeeper in the PL. I think that sums him up and probably reflects most people's thinking on him. There have also been games where hos poor distribution puts us under pressure, then the rest of the team gets nervy and the oppo get the wind in their sales. It can change the dynamic of the game

[Sciatika]

I reviewed all the premier league highlights this season and found the following errors leading to goals.

There were a couple of errors against Brighton: Their first goal happened because Sanchez came out to punch a ball he could not win. He might have saved the resulting header if he had stayed on his line, but would that header have been better had he not challenged for the ball? Their second was a poor pass out from Sanchez to Caicedo, who was robbed by the attacker who scored.

Against Arsenal, he let a goal in at the near post from Martinelli. He seems to have thought that Martinelli was going across his body.

Against Man Utd. he unnecessarily gives away a penalty. He would have been better off staying big.

The rest were just defensive errors or simply good play from the opposition. On the plus side, I saw quite a few spectacular saves. However, not all errors lead to goals. Having said that, I think people's reactions to Sanchez are more based on the apparent uncertainty of defences when under attack. Is that because of Sanchez, or because they are young, or some other reason? 

[Ham]

3 hours ago, Michael Tucker said:

Not many of them though.  

That's because nobody got near him.  

[chara]

@martin1905....Flattered by your confidence in my view 👨‍🦯😁

FWIW,,, covered it a bit in an earlier post here but as an overall view... I think by 27 a keeper has established his "credentials" and is a good as he is going to be in the basics of the position,,that doesn't mean he won't get more efficient, the reverse as you know...as experience runs in parallel with natural ability and fitness most good keepers just keep on adding layers to their game.

A very rough, unscientific, divide for me has always been "Lucky" keepers and equally as good but "Unlucky " keepers (James/Sprake)...I think Sanchez is wobbling on the edge of "Unlucky".

Another factor/question is who benefits in terms of confidence ? ..the keeper from a dependable defence or the defence from a dependable keeper..ideally it's a mutual exchange but in reality it rarely is that.

The JT/PC type of partnership with both players very self sufficient and united is rarely so well balanced.

At Chelsea at this time we have a questionable  not yet settled back line and a keeper who looks like a confidence player,,easily rattled by defensive wobbles and the same for the defence...sorry to keep using JT/PC as examples but put either player in the Chelsea defence now and everyone would benefit and gain confidence from very confident dominant top players

I think Sanchez is as good as he going to be and coaching is more a case of the coaches keeping on top of any negative tendencies that creep into his (and any players) game....  I suspect he will decline as age catches up and his superb reactions slow down , unlike the really top keepers who play longer as they draw upon experience and ability to counter the age drain..if all that makes sense?

Just my views not the defining argument. Thanks for asking.

[carrd]

On 24/12/2024 at 09:56, martin1905 said:

I'm just struggling a bit with all this talk about his mistakes and I'm not just talking about people on here. It seems everyone thinks the same but like I said in my original post I can't think of many mistakes he's made, apart from the obvious ones when it cones to his distribution, that have lead to us conceding. Even then how many times have the opposition scored direct from one of his mistakes placed passes?

Great keeper.  + tall and aggressive for crosses which makes a lot of people happy.
Maresca wants him to take risks with the ball, he does.  Maresca is very happy with that.  Me too.  Vertical football starts at the back and what is the point in having £250m invested in the pivot if you are scared of giving them the ball early.

[paulw66]

On 24/12/2024 at 02:16, Michael Tucker said:

IMO. the last 'proper' keeper we had was Cech.  After him, nobody has been that good.

Courtois...... unbelievable keeper. Odd that his exit has clouded judgement 

[Michael Tucker]

7 minutes ago, paulw66 said:

Courtois...... unbelievable keeper. Odd that his exit has clouded judgement 

It hasn't clouded mine, I just don't think that he was as good as Cech.

[chara]

11 minutes ago, Michael Tucker said:

It hasn't clouded mine, I just don't think that he was as good as Cech.

Agree....I believe his behavior leaving Chelsea certain threw a cloud over many fans view and memory of him without changing opinions regarding his ability.

[Chelsea_Matt]

1 hour ago, Michael Tucker said:

It hasn't clouded mine, I just don't think that he was as good as Cech.

Not even in the same class imo and Courtois *was* imo very good indeed. 

[paulw66]

1 hour ago, Michael Tucker said:

It hasn't clouded mine, I just don't think that he was as good as Cech.

That wasn't your point

He was very much a proper keeper

[Michael Tucker]

1 minute ago, paulw66 said:

That wasn't your point

He was very much a proper keeper

Didn't say that he wasn't, just that nobody get's close to Cech. 

Oh, and please don't tell me what my point was. Thank you.

[chara]

1 minute ago, paulw66 said:

That wasn't your point

He was very much a proper keeper

Never in question....my only very personal opinion is certainly at Chelsea he wasn't as good as PC but  like all the very top keepers he improved,,from a top level..as he gained the years and experience,,,still don;t have a good memory of him,,Snake,