thevelourfog

Yes, left that bit out because I've got enough of a reputation here for miserable cynicism, but history is pretty consistent that darlings get torn down. I think the defeat to Greece after so many attacking players all got into the same starting XI for once could have been the start of this generation's "you can't play Lampard and Gerrard" tedium, hopefully Tuchel puts paid to that. You at least get the impression that Cole isn't the sort of personality to get too big-headed about all the attention.

Cole Palmer making tea is the social media content I didn't know I needed. Feels very much like he's moving into national darling territory.

Haven't seen any Liverpool this season. Was under the impression that performances had generally been fine, but not as impressive as results have been. Don't know what to expect, really. That we persist in giving up 2 or 3 big chances per game makes it difficult to feel confident against almost anyone, regardless of other things going well.

Exactly what I was thinking. Would many people not buy a kit because it didn't have a sponsor? Maybe some people would wait, but struggle to believe that would be in significant numbers.

This and ... ... this. There are a few things I want to say in response and a few things I think it's best to leave as they are. I've taken a bit of time to redraft, and I want to be very clear it's because I genuinely have respect for you both, and certainly gratitude for your sponsorship of me. The first thing, and maybe a small thing, is that it is disappointing to see personal criticisms made of me by both of you without the decency to reply directly to or tag me. The second is related, and is that there is something quite perverse to me about the suggestion I have "bullied" or "gaslit" either of you, or my "methods" or "attitude" is untoward. The way I see it, I have expressed (robustly, I would agree) how I see things. Similarly robust expressions would not be, I think it is fair to say, uncharacteristic of either of you. I didn't say anything personal about either of you in my post. There is a claim to victimhood here that feels ... idk, grubby. We see things differently, we don't make bones about it. Difference is I'd never say either of you were "bullying" me. The third, and only thing I have the energy to say in reference to the point being discussed is ... Why on Earth would I have or need documentary evidence that the two sportspeople discussed have ovaries and vaginas? Do you think the basis for either failing their respective sports gender eligibility tests would be testosterone levels if they had didn't have female anatomy? Of course not. If either of them didn't have female genitalia, or had male genitalia, that would be the basis for them failing gender eligibility tests. For the little it is worth, both are known to have passports from countries that assign sex exclusively on what medical evidence indicates. Fair enough, invasive testing isn't part of any newborn screening process but I really struggle with the idea that either of you think it's a possibility doctors saw these sportspeople to have anything other than vaginas and still produced documentation to say they are female. I did not, and have never, questioned the need for eligibility testing and criteria in maintaining the integrity and safety of sport for all participants. As with last time, it is disingenuous to even suggest otherwise. On both this occasion and the last, I said sporting bodies get to decide who is eligible to participate, but those decisions should not (as is often the case in both the traditional and social medias) adjudicate on who is and isn't female. One thing is within the remit of sporting bodies and can have much more simple boundaries drawn around it. The other is much, much more complicated, and there is far less agreement on it than is suggested here. I will leave it at that, now. I won't reply to any replies either of you make. That won't be intended as concession or disrespect.

If I remember correctly, what caused "friction" was you repeating the lie that a person born with a vagina and ovaries was a "biological male". You, fair play, held your hands up to that at the time so this is a disappointing post to read now. Apparently it does need repeating. This is another sportsperson born with female sexual organs, who has been considered by all around her to be a woman for her whole life, and who has lived their entire life as a woman. 10, even 5 years, ago and in a different political climate, there would be almost no wider public interest in what hormones, and in what quantity, she had coursing through her body. If I remember correctly, this particular sportsperson was taking medication specifically to get their testosterone levels down ... To not have an advantage they just happened to be born with. Can you imagine a male sportsperson having to, or feeling they had to, do the same? It's maddening that tests designed to establish eligibility to compete in a sporting competition (and for all sportspeople, there are multiple criteria to meet) are so widely misrepresented being arbiters of gender. No sporting body gets to decide what is a man and what is a woman, just who meets registration criteria. Really, the only sensible conclusion anyone could reach from a person organically having female sexual organs but hormones more typical of a man should be "huh, maybe this idea you're one or the other doesn't work after all".

I also enjoyed the Daily Mail's "A DARK DAY FOR ENGLAND" headline. Where's the Royal family from, mates? And who are those Irish U21s I see training in the first XI? Sympathetic to the idea that national team managers should be from that nation, but totally mad how so many journalists have lost their tiny little jingoistic minds over this.

Looking increasingly like Tuchel will take the England job.

Some things to like, some things to be pretty worried about projected across an entire season. I like that there's genuinely fight to us this season, much better than last year's petulance. But it's not coordinated enough and we make it easy for the ref to choose a yellow card. And we simply concede, and give up chances, far too readily to be serious. Easy to project whatever your broader sense of optimism/pessimism is onto that result. For me, 5 points from the 12 available to us from PL home games so far doesn't scream CL qualification.

I'd be amazed by a victory over Arsenal, but our attack against their defence is quite the match up ... and what a reversal that is! United are dogshit but we love giving them something.

You left out Robert Sanchez's goal contributions!

"Ian Franco Zola" has completely done me.

He's rumoured to be on £13m a year. Even if that is a gross over estimation, he'll still be on wages well beyond the reach of all but 6 or 7 PL clubs. If he goes anywhere, I can't see it being permanently. In a minority I know, but I feel for him. Whatever happened with this ownership, even a best case reading suggests we messed him about a bit (and he may well have responded in kind), and then can't help but think the move not going to plan has really hit his confidence. But United are an absolute mess. I think they've spent heavily on some rubbish, but there are better players there than performances have suggested. I can't see how they get out if it any time soon, though. Ten Hag will have to go soon and can't see who they can get in other than leaving Van Nistelrooy in temporary charge for the season.

Feel like I should keep the thread updated given how generous you've all been. Not starting marathon-specific training for another month or so but did run the Ealing half today in 1hr 34mins. Felt pretty comfortable when the last one I did (start of September) was agony, so some confidence building I can keep going beyond the 13 miles! Manchester half in two weeks and then it's time to start running some distances I've never done before. https://strava.app.link/vpK4XVkWhNb

I thought yesterday was extremely Pochettino. I do not say that as criticism or praise, I've not been able to watch us often enough so far this season to have a view on how typical that is. But just that one performance was exactly the kind of basketball we played (at probably our best points, tbf) last season. If I didn't know there was a different coach, I wouldn't have been able to deduce it.