Wolverhampton Wanderers 1 Chelsea 0

[Blue Orca]

19 hours ago, ROTG said:

A real bizarre statement which is not entirely true.

With regards to over paid players, that is not entirely true,  At the start of August they were being coached by a WC coach which was the normal for most of the first team squad, then without warning TB has an epiphany decides to remove TT and his coaching staff and with a media hyped mid table coaching team who I doubt any of the first team had heard of, especially those why joined in the summer with the exception of a doggy left back.

Then you come to the real crux of the problem coaching. one can assume TT had a quite disciplined routing for the players  where each player new there roles and responsibilities which wins CL and other trophies. All of a sudden a team of top quality players are confronted with mid Pl / championship coaching team and routines with out any real purpose or objective, which over a course of time demoralizes a team, hence how the teams form headed south very once the TT discipline approached faded.

As for professionals with honour, there are plenty of them in the squad and I am sure they will rise to the top in the coming days once Frank and his coaching staff start bringing some life back into training.

Also this team is nowhere near as bad as some of the dross teams and players during the late 70" and 80"s

Nearly impossible  to compare a group of largely local lads in the 70 and 80s with a smattering of others from around the UK with today's choice of the best from around the world. Yes it was largely dross but we didn't know much different.

[kev61]

On 09/04/2023 at 01:21, xceleryx said:

 

Enzo has been one of our most consistent performers since arriving in January, his quality is visibly spades above others,

He has?.What exactly does he do that is "spades above others".

Honestly,what does he excel in.Sometimes I barely know if he is on the pitch.

He's a midfield player that should be dominant  in a game.

[xceleryx]

2 minutes ago, kev61 said:

He has?.What exactly does he do that is "spades above others".

Honestly,what does he excel in.Sometimes I barely know if he is on the pitch.

He's a midfield player that should be dominant  in a game.

I don't know Kev, you're virtually the only one that doesn't see or acknowledge his class. 

He's the perfect player for a possession based side with his elite usage of the ball, vision, creativity and passing. If you watched him at Benfica prior joining us at all you'd have seen a wider perspective of his game compared to how he's had to play here. I could rattle off statistics that highlight just how elite he is across an array of the aforementioned areas, but we know that's not going to change all too much either. From the eye test it's the way he conducts himself, the little things like how he moves, gets his head up early, his reading of the play, anticipation, touch, and so on. 

As I said in the original reply, right now we've got Enzo playing in a role/position that really doesn't maximise his full ability and therefore has held him back. Hopefully next season we'll have a proper holding player in the side that'll allow Enzo the freedom he warrants to get forward more often and be a greater impact in the final third, maybe then his quality will be more noticeable for you.

[kev61]

7 minutes ago, xceleryx said:

I don't know Kev, you're virtually the only one that doesn't see or acknowledge his class. 

 

Hells bells.I can see what Luca Modric brings to a game at the age of 38.

If most fans see what Enzo brings I have to say I'm wrong - but it doesn't stop me thinking what in gods name does he do?

[Michael Tucker]

I think that he's better than you claim kev, and not as good as Celery would have us believe. Somewhere in the middle then.

[Holymoly]

2 hours ago, Michael Tucker said:

I think that he's better than you claim kev, and not as good as Celery would have us believe. Somewhere in the middle then.

Certainly an upgrade on Jorginho to watch play.

[chiswickblue]

11 hours ago, Holymoly said:

Certainly an upgrade on Jorginho to watch play.

Ever since we signed Jorginho we've had an unbalanced midfield as he was signed to play as a regista, which meant we weren't going to sign any normal DM to play that role. So we've been trying to play with a midfield shape that no other top team has used in the last 6 years, with predictable results in the league.

[xceleryx]

7 hours ago, chiswickblue said:

Ever since we signed Jorginho we've had an unbalanced midfield as he was signed to play as a regista, which meant we weren't going to sign any normal DM to play that role. So we've been trying to play with a midfield shape that no other top team has used in the last 6 years, with predictable results in the league.

Jorginho alone wasn't the problem here to be fair, you also need to take a look at both Kovacic and Kante.  All three are good individual players, but when it came to a creating a balanced unit it wasn't a good trio based on their skillsets. We effectively partnered Jorginho with "support" types alongside and expected them both to heavily contribute in attacking phases which neither are ideally suited for. Big part of why we've had such dismal returns from the midfield group as a whole. 

Even if we signed a proper DM over Jorginho the same problems would've been faced. The reliance on Kova and Kante to have a huge say in our attacking phases of play was always a flawed approach in itself. 

[kev61]

3 hours ago, xceleryx said:

Jorginho alone wasn't the problem here to be fair, you also need to take a look at both Kovacic and Kante.  All three are good individual players, but when it came to a creating a balanced unit it wasn't a good trio based on their skillsets. We effectively partnered Jorginho with "support" types alongside and expected them both to heavily contribute in attacking phases which neither are ideally suited for. Big part of why we've had such dismal returns from the midfield group as a whole. 

Even if we signed a proper DM over Jorginho the same problems would've been faced. The reliance on Kova and Kante to have a huge say in our attacking phases of play was always a flawed approach in itself. 

How would you rank Kante in  comparison to Jorginho who you rank highly?

 

[ROTG]

On 10/04/2023 at 11:35, Holymoly said:

Certainly an upgrade on Jorginho to watch play.

Although the club is doing its best efforts knacker the lad for next seasons new coach - I guess playing every game is more to do with his transfer fee

Of course there will some on here will say, it is not about the money and forget his price tag

[xceleryx]

3 hours ago, kev61 said:

How would you rank Kante in  comparison to Jorginho who you rank highly?

They're both entirely different players.

Kante, at his peak, was a unique player virtually unrivalled by anyone else out there. What separated him was his ridiculous engine and ability to effectively get through the workload of two players at once. This softened allowed him to win the ball back in areas of the pitch no others could realistically reach. There's not much finesse about Kante however, and we've seen that in the later part of his carer with him spending more time higher up the pitch often leading counters, or being heavily involved in the build up of attacking phases. We've probably been far too reliant on him having an impact in the final third, rather than focusing more on him being a support player that could win the ball and then get it off to more astute players in these areas (which we've often lacked). 

Jorginho on the other hand played in a very different manner, with a game that centres more around his tactical proficiency, positioning, reading of play, and close control and less so about being physically dominant. I suppose in short he's a more intelligent type of player. Nowhere near as unique or as impactful at his peak as Kante, but still a very good player in his own right that does a lot of little thing that aren't necessarily as key-catching. Again, I think he was somewhat wasted after Sarri left and pigeon holed into a more holding based role opposed to the more tempo setting regista he arrived as. However still played a key role in some of the success we had during his time here.

But yeah, chalk and cheese really. Kante is more comparable to an Edgar Davids, Jorginho more like a mixture of Pirlo and Xavi Alonso without the expansive range of passing, but more in the manner they approached the game. 

[asvaberg]

I don't think we have seen the full potential of Enzo, yet! 

1) corners: please let someone else than James take them. Enzo?

2) free kicks: leave it to Enzo 

3) move Enzo a bit forward in the midfield, and Kante a bit back.