VAR - The Great Debate

[chara]

@flllerywhereru2..good points but I think we as a collective have come to accept the inevitable bias by default and the usual free fire zone around the Chelsea players before the usually first opportunity arises for a yellow due to the unlawful glare or,,gulp,,physical contact with an oppo player.

Just because we are paranoid etc.

[Sciatika]

It was Andrew Madley. That was one of his more competent performances.

[Bison]

Amazing how everybody seems to get an apology except Chelsea. 

[Mark Kelly]

1 hour ago, Bison said:

Amazing how everybody seems to get an apology except Chelsea. 

We're the baddies. 

Just seen Xhaka purposefully elbow Trent Alexander Awful in the face, no VAR just a yellow. That's one of ours he's off regardless. 

 

Edited April 9, 2023 by Mark Kelly

[flllerywhereru2]

And our apology for refusing to give a pen for the push on Pullisic in the box on saturday.....(ok so we may well have missed the penalty)

[chara]

OG pre match nervy rambling.

After posting some "OG stuff" elsewhere got to idly memory strolling and for some reason wandered back to Villa Park and a semi final v Liverpool.

I was behind the goal as a John Mortimore effort was disallowed for a "foul" on the scouse keeper.... an early example of the present day "trend"...imho the keeper..Lawrence..went up into John's headed effort and a bad ref decision even given my much less cynical approach to the game as a "younger" version of me.

The saving grace of course is that the ref had only real a time view of the incident and possibly a lino opinion.

No excuses now but still the same bad decisions week in week out.

Today given the same circumstances I think I..and most present... would be waiting stolidly for the inevitable 20 minute (or two second ) VAR "debate" before the goal was disallowed.

Just pre match thoughts to settle me but......

[flllerywhereru2]

14 hours ago, chara said:

OG pre match nervy rambling.

After posting some "OG stuff" elsewhere got to idly memory strolling and for some reason wandered back to Villa Park and a semi final v Liverpool.

I was behind the goal as a John Mortimore effort was disallowed for a "foul" on the scouse keeper.... an early example of the present day "trend"...imho the keeper..Lawrence..went up into John's headed effort and a bad ref decision even given my much less cynical approach to the game as a "younger" version of me.

The saving grace of course is that the ref had only real a time view of the incident and possibly a lino opinion.

No excuses now but still the same bad decisions week in week out.

Today given the same circumstances I think I..and most present... would be waiting stolidly for the inevitable 20 minute (or two second ) VAR "debate" before the goal was disallowed.

Just pre match thoughts to settle me but......

Yes, i guess it is nothing new but it does feel with VAR it has given the officials an extra stick to beat us with. 

 

Does anyone else feel like the european refs are less visible and only use VAR when really necessary and not in a showy way?  We can win or lose in Europe but i dont feel like we are getting targetted or cheated. It also makes you feel you are watching  a sporting event rather than a tv show.

[Bison]

 

Clear handball which led directly to the phase of play that resulted in the goal however the goal has been allowed to stand.

[east lower]

Well, I’ve just watched TAA blatantly move his arm to the ball and gain the advantage that two or three passes later has the ball in the oppositions goal,

The VAR ruled that the handball (they agreed it was handball!) occurred too far back in play to disallow the goal.

Wasn't the whole point, or the selling point of the system was to correct injustice caused by incorrect decisions.

But it’s for the red scum, so normal rules don’t apply.

Edit: just saw @Bison post, picture paints a thousand words

Edited April 17, 2023 by east lower

[thevelourfog]

https://www.premierleague.com/news/2204759

Completely mad, but it's not a handball anymore. An insane rule given it would be if Alexander-Arnold had scored himself. There have been a few like it since the rule change, remember United getting done at home by Middlesbrough because of it.

[Mark Kelly]

25 minutes ago, east lower said:

Well, I’ve just watched TAA blatantly move his arm to the ball and gain the advantage that two or three passes later has the ball in the oppositions goal,

The VAR ruled that the handball (they agreed it was handball!) occurred too far back in play to disallow the goal.

Wasn't the whole point, or the selling point of the system was to correct injustice caused by incorrect decisions.

But it’s for the red scum, so normal rules don’t apply.

Edit: just saw @Bison post, picture paints a thousand words

Didn't they go back twenty seven seconds which is a long time in football to deny us earlier in the season?

Our games are refereed differently to anyone elses.

[east lower]

38 minutes ago, thevelourfog said:

https://www.premierleague.com/news/2204759

Completely mad, but it's not a handball anymore. An insane rule given it would be if Alexander-Arnold had scored himself. There have been a few like it since the rule change, remember United getting done at home by Middlesbrough because of it.

When the player moves their arm towards the ball it ceases to be ‘accidental’  - that’s the crux on this one. He moves his arm out to the ball.

Even the non-biased pundit Carragher, had a bit of trouble justifying it.

[Bison]

 

Understandable. It much easier to cheat when it's a man in a van drawing lines. 

[Backbiter]

15 hours ago, Bison said:

 

Understandable. It much easier to cheat when it's a man in a van drawing lines. 

Is the player in yellow Lukaku and the one in white VVD?

[flllerywhereru2]

On 09/06/2023 at 13:53, Backbiter said:

Is the player in yellow Lukaku and the one in white VVD?

Looks suspisciously like it doesnt it, a fine example of engineering the outcome that one

[Holymoly]

Match Day One and we have already been treated to the reality that the "new" VAR standards still won't apply to Manure. But it's all alright because the PGMOL has apologised to Wolves.

[Ham]

46 minutes ago, Holymoly said:

Match Day One and we have already been treated to the reality that the "new" VAR standards still won't apply to Manure. But it's all alright because the PGMOL has apologised to Wolves.

Great performance by us against top opposition. Awful performance by United. 

They're undeservably on maximum points. We're not. 

Well done PGMOL. 

[Mark Kelly]

13 minutes ago, Ham said:

Great performance by us against top opposition. Awful performance by United. 

They're undeservably on maximum points. We're not. 

Well done PGMOL. 

The league gotta have a strong United 

[blueandproud]

The officials for that must have been Mr Magoo as the ref, David Blunkett and Richard Pryor's character in See No Evil, Hear No Evil and Sttevie Wonder on VAR.  It was an absolute joke.

[paulw66]

16 hours ago, blueandproud said:

The officials for that must have been Mr Magoo as the ref, David Blunkett and Richard Pryor's character in See No Evil, Hear No Evil and Sttevie Wonder on VAR.  It was an absolute joke.

the greatest movie most people haven't seen

[Holymoly]

Mike Dean declined to use VAR to save a 'mate' and fellow referee from 'grief' - BBC Sport

And THAT my friends is why the system is a shambles. Unprofessional, incompetant, biased and corrupt officiating.

Gentle reminder too of the reasoning behind the FA charging Thomas Tuchel after that game:

"It is alleged that the manager's comments in his post-match press conference constitute improper conduct... they imply bias and/or question the integrity of the match referee, and/or bring the game into disrepute”

 

Edited August 25, 2023 by Holymoly

[Mark Kelly]

36 minutes ago, Holymoly said:

Mike Dean declined to use VAR to save a 'mate' and fellow referee from 'grief' - BBC Sport

And THAT my friends is why the system is a shambles. Unprofessional, incompetant, biased and corrupt officiating.

Gentle reminder too of the reasoning behind the FA charging Thomas Tuchel after that game:

"It is alleged that the manager's comments in his post-match press conference constitute improper conduct... they imply bias and/or question the integrity of the match referee, and/or bring the game into disrepute”

 

We've now had this where Tuchel is charged after being correct in his assumptions plus Clattenburg admitting he purposefully didn't send off any Spurs players because he didn't want to be the man who cost Spurs the league in the battle of the Bridge which resulted in a fine of £100k for the club .

We as an organisation have been proven right twice and the PGMOL have been proven to be actively managing the outcome of games rather than officiating them even handedly.

Heads should roll , however , nobody except us , cares .

[Bert19]

30 minutes ago, Mark Kelly said:

We've now had this where Tuchel is charged after being correct in his assumptions plus Clattenburg admitting he purposefully didn't send off any Spurs players because he didn't want to be the man who cost Spurs the league in the battle of the Bridge which resulted in a fine of £100k for the club .

We as an organisation have been proven right twice and the PGMOL have been proven to be actively managing the outcome of games rather than officiating them even handedly.

Heads should roll , however , nobody except us , cares .

I think it would be reasonable for the Club to publish a letter written to the PGMOL questioning Dean's admission and motivations whilst asking how they will guarantee that this is not something we will ever have to ask about again. 

IMO, we as a Club are perfectly entitled to question this admission.

[Backbiter]

The PGMOL is more concerned with dealing with criticism of refs than with dealing with a lack of integrity amongst its most high-profile officials.

[Holymoly]

36 minutes ago, Backbiter said:

The PGMOL is more concerned with dealing with criticism of refs than with dealing with a lack of integrity amongst its most high-profile officials.

Any why should the officials have ANY profile? They should be invisible.